Australia

Road Cycling and Safety

Forestwood

I leant out the car window this morning and had a conversation with a road cyclist at the traffic lights. I wanted to know why so many cyclists appear to choose NOT to ride on the outer or footpath side of the road, but position themselves on the inner side, dangerously close to where the cars travel. Ordinarily, this wouldn’t concern me, but it’s been a hot topic of whinging and conversation in the community, so I was a tad curious.

A simple enough question that had a surprising answer.

journey with a cyclist riding in a fog early morning

Road cycling is the most widespread form of cycling. It includes recreational, racing, commuting, and utility cycling. Road cyclists are generally expected to obey the same rules and laws as other vehicle drivers or riders and may also be vehicular cyclists.

Wikipedia

Upon hearing my enquiry, this rather brash, lycra-clad rider put up his hackles. His stood tall on his bike, puffed his chest out, and his body language indicated he was ready for battle.

“It is not a dedicated bike lane back there,” he spat. “Read your road rules, love.”

I will admit Australia is slow to join the party when it comes to accommodating cyclists. The vast majority of major roads have no bike lanes, so cyclists must compete with trucks, cars, buses and all road users. Cyclists pay zero registration costs to contribute to the upkeep of the roads which earns the ire of the driving community. Rules vary from place to place but here we must keep 1 metre away from the bikes, when driving on the roads, due to the many cyclist deaths in commuter traffic.

Keeping 1 metre away would be simple if the cyclist kept to the outer or even the middle section of the emergency stopping lane, or roadside verge or bike lane, where there is one, but almost all seem to prefer to stick close to cars, which means the cars need to veer into the next lane, in order to comply with the 1-metre distance rule.

Bridge
A Norwegian cyclist

But I digress. Let’s go back to the discussion with the lycra-clad cyclist. As my intention wasn’t to debate the road rules, I clarified that I wanted to understand the motives behind the cyclist’s choice, so I persisted and, the traffic light was still red.

“On a Sunday morning”, he continued, “there’s so much glass on the road after Saturday night, that if I was to ride on the left (footpath), side of the road, I’d get nothing but flat tyres. So we all ride on the inside near the cars.”

– Road Cyclist in Red Lycra

As the traffic light then changed to green, I thanked him for the explanation and wound up my car window. His body language relaxed and he took off in another direction.

Yet, I was still left wondering – could there really be so much glass on ALL the major roads in our city? It just didn’t seem plausible. Is a flat tyre less preferable than safety?

Is this a problem in other countries without bike lanes?

Less than 30 minutes later, I was walking with friends along the beach with our dogs and recounted my story about the cyclist. We were all in agreeance, questioning the validity of the flat tyre argument, when one of the girl’s mobile phone rang.

On answering it, my friend let out a hearty laugh.

Her daughter had called to say she was on a bike ride on an inner city road and had just got a flat tyre!

Sometimes strange coincidences are not that strange after all.

Published by Forestwood

A philosophic Aussie writes here at StPA, one who will readily admit to loving Scandinavia. I'm interested in global politics and what drives us to be who we are. Scratch the surface and you'll find a practical Environmentalist with an egalitarian bent, trying to unleash a little creativity via the written word. Scandinavian culture, literature and traditions are close to my heart, even though I'm Australian. Travel and courteous discussions greatly broaden the mind, so I travel if I can and am always up for a vigorous, respectful discussion. I'm an avid reader, a writer and I enjoy photography and crafts, particularly traditional art forms. I hope you'll find 'Something to Ponder About,' in my WordPress Community.

100 thoughts on “Road Cycling and Safety”

  1. As a very long term cycle commuter I can lend further light on your problem. If one rides on the far left of the road, if a car swerves towards you or passes too close you have nowhere to go. Therefore the sensible place to ride is where you have enough room to head to safety (which is not over the curb!) in the MANY instances when cars come so close they risk clipping your body with their wing mirror. Sometimes I experience cars overtaking coming towards me i.e. they are coming towards me in my lane overtaking a car on the other side of the room. Then you really want some room! One of the problems here is that the car driver is pretty much never injured in a collision, it is the cyclist who needs to have all the safety they can get. Another problem is that if all the people in the cars (I am one of them too) got out on bikes on a regular basis and found out what it is like on a bike they might be clearer about why cyclists do what they do and give them more space. We have a funny state of affairs in Australasia where we think that cars have more rights than cyclists or walkers. In some parts of the world, cars always have to give way to pedestrians and cyclists. On the sea, powered craft have to give way to unpowered craft.

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    1. Thanks Jane for your valued comment. It does give me a clearer picture of the difficulties cyclists face, although I did gain some idea when a friend’s husband commuted by bike to the city. After 3 near misses and 2 falls within a year, from cars he suspected deliberately went for him, he finally decided to change to travelling by train. Biking was just too dangerous here. Until we get more dedicated bike lanes, and driver education, I don’t think much will change. One further question though, when cyclists overtake a parked vehicle, should the cyclist look behind before overtaking? I do think cyclists might be safer doing that and keeping more in single file where possible? Often they are riding two or three abreast which doesn’t give them any room to move either.

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      1. Same problem in Italy if not worst. We have very few cycling paths but most cyclists prefer the paved road, and as mentioned above two or three abreast at that. I hate it when I’m driving and have to keep a steady 30 Km per hour, hoping the cyclists will move to the side of the road. Most here are undisciplined but some do have rearview mirrors on their helmets and obey the rules and laws as other drivers. How ironic that your daughter got a flat tire.

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      2. Interesting that Italy differs from some other Scandi- Euro countries. I remember some very narrow roads in the North of Italy so I would hate to have to pass cyclists by, on those streets. I suppose the cites are so old and the traffic already congested so adding bike lanes might not be feasible?

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  2. What a coincidence about the daughter getting the flat tire.
    —
    And I like how you went right to a biker to get their motive and outlook
    —
    We are starting to get more bike lanes in our city and suburbs – but not nearly enough trails –
    And this is opinionated – but I think that bikers really should not be in the streets in ways trust force cars to veer over

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    1. Hey Yvette, how are you? I’m so glad to hear from you and it’s ok to be opinionated here. That’s fine because everybody lives in different areas with different circumstances, so all good.
      Do you have the 1 metre rule in your region?

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      1. I am not sure about the 1-meter rule here (so bad, haha) but we do have some areas with bike lanes that have been invested in with some $ – bright green lines near intersections, thicker white lines, and I like having that made clearer –
        and things are pretty good hear.
        Working on a handful of projects and did way too much writing in June – haha – and then finally got the chance to see the newest grandson. My step-daughter had her second child, a boy names James Edward (stately name, eh?) and we made a careful trip to visit..
        and you? how goes it amiga

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      2. I knew you would be busy and good to hear you have a few projects including writing on the go. Congratulations on your new grandson! Visits are very local here at the moment although some parts have opened up a little. Travelling is not on the cards for a while, for any of us, it seems.
        I have just borrowed a kayak from a family member and am going to try that out on our lake. Having just about retired from work, I can plan to do some different things now. (Covid made me bring this forward by 1 year).
        Fantastic that you see more bike lanes and folks riding bikes over your way too.
        What kind of projects you are working on?

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      3. Well
        Hope the kayaking happens for you….
        And our trio to meet grandson was delayed three times and then cut to the shortest amount of time we could make it happen in –
        So that added to the feeling like “I was hit by a truck” after it was done!
        Haha
        But we kept it COVID safe and now
        Rested up and ready for next part of July 😉
        All of My Projects are writing projects and doing some small books – some research, and trying to put together a workbook for
        self- help stuff. For example – A small
        Project is an idea of a workbook for
        grief processing and a few other key areas That people can use to do some self work…. but that might be a ways out — but It is one that I feel
        Is needed the most.
        One of my projects I started collecting snippets for more than ten years ago and it is 90% but it has to stay on the B list right now
        —
        😊🌸🌸✌️🌺🌺🌺

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      4. I have three books in mind to write. I don’t know if I will ever get to finishing (or starting) them all. My cousin in New Zealand has churned out 2 and is on her third, so I should follow her lead. I am very much a novice re the whole publishing processes. Your grief processing book sounds really useful, anything that is self directed is welcome.

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      5. Let me know how I can help get you started on your self publishing path.
        I have helped two other authors and it is just a way to get momentum – seriously – it would not take me long at all and I love helping with what I learned Doing “lady by the river” and “avian friends“ –
        Oh my goodness did I learn a lot and did some grinding it out!!
        Hahaha
        So let’s connect via email about this – 😉
        -/
        And the useful word is what really underpins the workbook.
        Amanda – I wish I had it ready to go right now because I k is two folks who could use it. And I cannot start in it until I finish a few more pressing things – but all good/ one day at a time right

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      6. Thank you so much, Yvette that is extremely kind of you to help me. I would love that. I just had a look and cannot see a contact page to find your email, on your blog. My email addy is on my contact page if you don’t want to post yours here, drop me a line and I will email back.

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      7. Sounds good – I will email you – also – I need to set up a contact page – thanks for reminding me
        Oh and we listened to some Boston on our trip and heard part of “Amanda” and thought of you 🎼🎼🎼🎼

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  3. I echo Jane’s comments. Plus, although we have a fair number of bike lanes they too often contain glass which has been deliberately smashed there by non-bike fans.

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    1. Thanks for commenting Sheree. I was interested to hear your comments in particular, as I knew you were an avid cyclist. To think people put glass there deliberately – I am disgusted. It would only incite more aggravation and not reduce the number of cyclists.

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  4. Bike riding in Northern Europe and here in Australia are totally different. I come from Holland where one is almost born on a bike, or if not born, conceived during bike riding events. The European rides on sturdy sensible bikes and use it as a form of transport to get from a to b.

    Here, in Australia bikes are skinny and used for sport more than for transport. Hence the Lycra clad fashion and multi geared machines made for speed and sport. The saddle often higher than the handle bars with heads downwards instead of upright watching traffic.
    Also, in many European countries no obligatory laws for helmets as they too can impede on hearing and visuals. Believe me the science is out on that issue.

    Of course, at least in Holland you can go almost anywhere and not be sharing roads with cars. I am sometimes amazed how bike riders seem to stay a metre or so from the edge of the road. Hair raising, but of course the car just has to do everything to avoid colliding. The two are not meant to be together, I think.
    The answer; bike paths!

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    1. Very interesting to hear your views Gerard and I understand the mentality is different in Europe, but I did not realise the bikes are so different. Even though I have seen them many of them in Holland and in Denmark, it never occurred to me how vastly different they are, but your explanation of the differences makes it clear. The saddle being higher than the handlebars would make the rider more unstable!

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  5. That was most interesting. A friend in England bikes to work in London. Since I’ve known him, he has been hit by a car twice. He used to wear a cam that recorded every trip. Maybe he still does.

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    1. Oh my goodness, Anne. Your poor friend. I do hope he recovered okay from his accidents and that the cam is a way to understand and clarify what happened. A very good idea.

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  6. I don’t ride a bike, but my husband is a keen cyclist. Cycling is a green and healthy node of transport and far more consideration should be given to it by road planners. My husband could have written that comment by Janecshearer. Of course there are poor and inconsiderate cyclists, but what I observe is motorists driving thoughtlessly near cyclists, and feeling entitled to do so.I have no idea why cyclists should pay road taxes – even accepting that building dedicated cycle lanes comes at a cost – when cyclists don’t deplete natural resources or pollute the environment, and rarely cause (as opposed to be involved in) debilitating road incidents that can result in serious injury or death.

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    1. Great point, Margaret. Riding a bicycle is better for the environment and decreases the amount of vehicles on our roads, and have very little impact on our roads. Most cyclists probably also have a car, and pay road taxes, as someone pointed out.

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  7. Some great arguments here. We’re dog walkers and find heaps of glass on the roadside. I certainly wouldn’t be riding on the side and can barely walk the dog there.

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    1. On all roads, Peggy? I don’t see too much here at all, but don’t walk on main roads ans stick to footpaths. The council here spent millions of dollars making a new bike path and apparently the cyclist won’t use it and stay on the road!

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  8. You’ve raised an interesting argument and I’ve appreciated everybody’s view here. Part of our problem is that as a ‘wide, brown land’ we’ve developed as a car-based society. It’s simply too far to ride for many people. I think dedicated bike lanes (as in, separated from the traffic) and bike paths are probably the only really safe options here. Having said that, as a runner who utilises a shared pathway regularly, I’ve had my share of inconsiderate cyclists who act towards pedestrians and runners on that path much like motorists do to cyclists on the roads. Really, the world would work if we all just exercised some consideration of each other.

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    1. Hey Mosy, fantastic point. We have certainly experienced cyclists who ride too close to us as dog walkers, on shared pedestrian/bike paths scaring the absolute willies out of us, when they zoosh past at high speed. We are a car-based society indeed but where is the broken glass coming from?

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      2. I did hear of folks putting out nails and screws in and around the gutters and parking lanes because they disliked train commuters hogging all the parks outside their flats around train stations. If people can do that, perhaps others do break glass there deliberately!

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    1. I think they have forgotten about these important matters when using the road. I do remember using hand signals when riding a bike as a young teen going to high school.

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  11. Over the last few years Toronto has been introducing more bike lanes in the city core. There was a lot of debate on it – from drivers who hated the road reductions in an already traffic congested city and from bike riders who hated the air pollution & arrogance of car drivers. Many bikers complained about drivers who’d cut them off at street corners, stop in bike lanes and suddenly open car doors without looking. Drivers would complain about bikers ignoring stop signs and drifting into traffic. The ‘loser’ in a car&bike argument is always the biker but really no one is a winner. It seems to me that bike lanes can only do good.

    I’ve heard that with COVID there’s a resurgence in the popularity of bikes. People are using them as an alternative to public transit and they’re good options for being outside and maintaining social distance. I think this is a good thing. It’s certainly healthier and better for the environment. If our city infrastructure also gets transformed – all the better.

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    1. So true that bikes are a healthy alternative to public transport for avoiding Covid, although breathing in exhaust emissions in the inner city probably isn’t. There are always fors and againsts. The bikes are in the more vulnerable position. I think we have to accept that in cities not made for biking it is going to be a dangerous activity if you wish to ride close to cars. In cities with purposebuilt bike lanes, we can keep both camps happy. It is interesting to note that when the new 1 metre rule came in, there was over 200 bikers fined in the first few weeks for non -compliance and only a handful of car drivers. The rules apply to the bikes too, flat tyre risk or no flat tyre risk.

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  12. i cycle every time I visit my friend here in the UK. We only use dedicated bike lanes not even on the main road and yet glass is still everywhere. There are certain underpasses where young men appear to drink and drug dealers gather and bizarrely seem to only drink from glass bottles which they smash next to the underpasses. It happened so often we once thought perhaps local cycle shops were paying people to smash bottles to give them trade!

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    1. The romper stompers seem hell bent on proliferating their rubbish. Darn them. I was thinking that maybe those alcoholic drinks should be made using plastic bottles, but then it is not alleviating the root cause. The tendency to not care about others or the consequences of their actions is the problem.
      If more rubbish bins were provided, would it make any difference? Possibly not.
      The city council could employ more people – it is a job that noone wants to do but with appropriate tools could be done quickly? Pay people enough and they will do the job.
      Build the cost of that role into a deposit on the alcoholic drink when it is purchased – which could be re-claimed if it is returned to a recycling depot. The homeless could derive an income from collecting (whole) bottles not disposed of correctly, perhaps? Is that feasible, Klodo, or a pipe dream?

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      1. Everything that requites extra money seems to be ignored. We wont know the true extent of the virus lock-down for several years yet but with already overstretched budgets being taken to breaking point by the virus I would guess pollution, litter and recycling will go back to the bottom of the pile of concerns again.

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      2. No doubt. When there are budget cuts the environment is always the first to be slashed. There is some talk now that we will have to accept a small level of covid will always potentially be around. That doesn’t sound like fun.

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      3. No, they are even saying over here that the second wave may kill more people and go on til next spring with more lockdowns. Its starting to sound like a Youtube conspiracy theory!

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      4. It is, as it suits a particular agenda. Get rid of the unhealthy ( who are a drain on the health system and cost billions, get rid of the poverty stricken, get rid of environmental concerns,and increase dependence on emerging markets through direct purchase, economic domination, financial loans and time to develop and edge militarily).

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    1. Thank you Himanshu. That is very kind. I already received one of these, about ten years ago! I have been blogging for many years. Good luck with your journey through blogging. I can highly recommend it.

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  14. Like many commenters have said, the side of the road often contains glass, rocks, trash, etc. that is either put the on purpose (I hate to think that’s true) or gathers there as traffic, wind, and rain push it that way. I often find that the sides have a lot of potholes and cracks. I’m glad you were able to push through the cyclist’s initial defensiveness to get a better answer.

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    1. That makes sense, Janis. The slipstream of cars and the natural camber of road drainage design would mean that refuse, glass (as commenters vouch for) and other obstacles, naturally drift towards the outer edge. Even parked cars are dangerous obstacles. We do need more bike paths, and road sweepers (?), perhaps or even a low guard rail of sorts as separation. (With breaks in between for turning).

      I only wish the riders could keep a teeny bit more towards that outer side rather than sit directly on that thin white line that separates cars from their fragile bodies.

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  15. Having cycled 70 km today, I thought I had to comment on your post. I got a pedelec in May and have used it for trips to the shops as well as for little tours.

    In case you don’t know (and I didn’t really know before I bought my bike), the difference between a pedelec and an e-bike is that the former is assisted pedalling (as much or as little as you choose) and the other is a bike with an e-motor like the small mopeds with petrol motors we used to have in the 70s). Hence the difference is also speed. And I’m proud to mention that my battery was even half drained by the time I go home today.

    What was new for me today was that I took the train for the first leg of my ride. In regional trains you can take a bike with you on the train free of charge (except on workdays between 6 and 9 am). My first surprise was how many people with bikes were on the train on a Sunday afternoon. The sections of the carriage where bikes have to be stored were quite crowded.

    I met friends in Frankfurt and we went on a ride. Having read your piece in the morning I paid close attention to the condition of the bike lanes (as Frankfurt is Germany’s fifth largest city and I normally drive around in a small town) I didn’t see any glass anywhere (I think it is disgusting and actually utterly unbelievable that somebody would do that on purpose). The lanes were in various conditions. Sometimes we were forced to use the road rather than the bike lane because of the condition of the bike lanes: the tree´roots from the trees planted on the side of the roads have come up and the surface is very bumpy. But in general, there are bike lanes (either completely separate from the road or painted in red on the side of the road). Having said that, it was a Sunday and it must be something else to drive in a big city with normal weekday traffic. My way home led me around the Frankfurt airport and I felt safe all the time the way the traffic was organised.

    There are lots of arguments between bike riders and cars in Germany as well. The tax argument is in my opinion not valid as most bike riders are also car drivers at other times, and pedestrians don’t pay for roads either. Many cities are trying to establish more bike lanes. As space is limited in already established areas the bike lanes are taking lanes away from cars. The idea is also to force more people to either use bicycles or public transport to reduce pollution and traffic congestion. As good as the idea is (and I feel necessary in the long run), it angers car drivers in the short run and tempers flare. Neither group seem to able to see the points of the other side even if at times they switch groups. The same holds true for pedestrians. Yes, cyclists sometimes drive too close and too fast past walkers. But I also regularly encounter pedestrians who walk in the middle of the path making it difficult to pass them and also making erratic steps to the side (that’s how I fell really badly with my scooter a while back). And they are annoyed if you ring the bell (from a distance so that they are not taken by surprise of me rushing up). I think riding my bike has made me a better car driver and a better pedestrian.

    Maybe the solution is forced switching between different modes of transport (including walking).

    Okay, that has gotten quite long so I will stop here. It seems to be a contentious topic almost anywhere in the world that can only be solved with goodwill from all sides.

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    1. Thanks for taking the time to make a lengthy comment. I love long comments. Well done to note the conditions of the roads during your bike ride today, Knickers. I quite agree that there are mistakes and misconceptions on both sides of the issue and attitudes could be softened a little, if we are to see any kind of conciliation. When I’m walking along a shared bike/walking path, as a pedestrian, I actually prefer cyclists to ring their bells, as a warning, and thank the ones that do. I love to get a warning that someone is coming past me. Yes, tree roots would also be a problem as are many other obstacles. As a worker in disability: people in wheelchairs, in the past, I can confirm that there are many, many obstacles on the streets and footpaths. When you’re walking around or driving a power or manual wheelchair, you wouldn’t believe the things that you have to go around that are in your way forward. It’s not just a problem on bike lanes but also on footpaths. Cracked footpaths, footpath blocked with rubbish bins, or various pieces of trash, or car trailers, caravans, you name it. All these things require the attendant or wheelchair user to move onto the road and go around the obstacle, which is not easy to do in traffic, when you’re in a wheelchair. There’s lots of things that transport departments could do to try to improve cities, maybe town planners as well. Thanks for your valued comment.
      I do have to ask- were you passing through or around Offenbach, as you mentioned Frankfurt airport? I remember visiting that lovely town once. It was just outside Frankfurt and I really liked the place.

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      1. They’ve just upped the fines for cars parking in bike lanes and on sideways in Germany (great problem: lack of parking space). I don’t know if these fines will keep as other parts of the law (higher fines and revocation of the driver’s licence for a period) will stand as there were formal mistakes in the law (bumbling, incompetent minister). — Offenbach: I think it is the first time ever that I heard anybody refer to Offenbach as a “lovely town”. It has a horrible reputation. The city has a very high (comparatively) crime rate, parts of almost ghetto like character with school classes reported to have almost no German mothertongue speaking students, economically very poor.
        The car registration is OF which many say stand for “Ohne Führerschein” (the drivers have the reputation of ignoring rules), and some even say: “Ohne Ferstand” (which means without brains but misspelt). I know that there are nice places (particularly along the Main), though. Our running group has been there in the past. It is to the east and south east of Frankfurt.

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      2. I stayed there in 2010. Perhaps it was different then? I loved the Schloss and small Christmas market and walking along the Main river. As it was my first experience of Germany and hafn’y yet been into the city of Frankfurt, I was delighted by Offenbach’s falling Autumnal leaves, the squirrels running up and down the trees and the buildings around the Schloss and main centre. I remember prices were very very cheap then and my daughter and I bought lots of warm clothes it was winter), and ate “Super Dickman,” at the markets. It is sad to hear it has declined into a place that doesn’t sound safe.

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      3. No, Offenbach has never had a good reputation. The percentage of inhabitants with “migration background” (the political correct term for people who have non-German ancestors – but I wouldn’t know how far back). In Germany it’s about 20% (which sounds like a lot to me but the source is reputable, possibly it is really going back 2 generations). In Hessen it is 28%. And in Offebach it is 60%. https://www.fr.de/rhein-main/offenbach/offenbach-spitze-integration-11024339.html#:~:text=Offenbach%20ist%20die%20Stadt%20in,Prozent%20der%20Menschen%20einen%20Migrationshintergrund.
        This is not per se bad (and certainly no for me) but it creates problems which are different from other places. In former times, the main parts of Offenbach was very industrial, lots of unskilled workers, always a lot of unemployed people. The area around the Schloss and further away from Frankfurt are exceptional. This goes back well into into the times of the industrial revolution. Glad you liked “Dickmanns” – I do, too. There are also bone of contention because of political correctness issues. Orginally, this confectionary was called either “negro’s kiss” or “(blacka)moor’s head”. Old-minded people insist that they don’t mean anything bad by it but are unable to change even though it is offensive to many Germans.

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      4. Another part of life that must be altered to new social conventions and norms. I thought Super Dickman was very unPC and my daughter and I chuckled a lot about that. But Negro’s kiss is even worse. Funny how we think we are becoming more liberal but we are becoming more regulated as time goes on.
        Interesting about Offenbach. I must have been in the exceptional part. I didn’t see any homeless or wayward folk and saw more homeless in Berlin and Gypsies in Verona, Italy and the odd Turk in Eastern Holland. But then perhaps I don’t notice ehtnicities so much as it is pretty multi-cultural in Australia anyway.

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      1. It’s great and I love mine. We live on the elevation next to the wide Rhine valley, i.e. to the west everything is flat and I wouldn’t need any assistance (except for the last 300m on my way home and that more psychologically than anything else was always a bind). But anything to the east is very hilly. And that has opened up for me, I go to places i would have never reached before.

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  17. I’m not a cyclist, but I’ve used a bike in some countries… In Sweden it was easy, there were so many bike lanes through the forest that I didn’t need to go on roads to get from my neighborhood in the suburbs to Stockholm. It was very safe there!
    Dublin has also a bike culture and some clearly marked bike lanes… But I’ve also seen many accidents because bike lanes weren’t everywhere and it was a bit dangerous to cross some streets shared with cars…
    In Spain people want to introduce also this bike culture… But I find it very difficult in some cities. For example, Madrid is not design for bikes, not matter if they add bike lanes in some streets. Car drivers are simply not used to share the street with bikes or even motorbikes! And in many streets, the solution is to add the bike lane in the sidewalks, which is also dangerous for pedestrians!
    I guess solutions are not easy anywhere! I think cyclist should at least make a course or something, so they also learn how to bike with other vehicles and pedestrians around…

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    1. Some training or a bike permit exam would be a great start. Compliance and enforcing rules is always less realistic than learning them. Creation of bike paths are difficult unless they were built into the original city plans.
      Coincidentally, I was listening to a segment on the radio today which talked about the reasons why Denmark and Holland ended up being bike-friendly , whereas places like Germany and Austria did not. Historically, when cars came into Vogue after the first world war, it appears that bikes were associated more with the working class, particularly in Germany and Austria where they developed a very good public transport system. Thus, bikes were abandoned in favour of cars whereas there was no working class- bike association in Holland and Denmark and they did not have the resources to develop an intensive public transport system, so bikes were still favoured as a easy mode of getting around. Interestingly, they also suggested that had America not developed an extensive rail network then bikes may be more in use there.

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      1. You are welcome forestwood! We were referring to your most thorough analyses of cycling. Have an awesome day! It is interesting to know how cycling worldwide is being impacted! 🚴🏿‍♂️🚴‍♀️☕️☕️☕️☕️

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      2. Hi there America on Coffee – and update is I have taken note of the groups of road cyclists that are out on Sunday mornings. They like to ride two abreast in the bike lanes – which kind of shoots a big hole in their theory of having to stay on the inner side near the cars due to rubbish on the bike or car verge lanes. Why is it okay to move into the outer edge, if you have a buddy beside you?

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      6. Hi I did reply, don’t why you have not received. 🤔No-O problem! AOC had only wish to commend you on the coverage of your cycling share. It was done beautifully. Best wishes.💕☕️☕️

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  19. Hello Forestwood, your share was beautifully, well covered. Most of us would never think that cycling changes and challenges are happening throughout the world. Cheers to your having an awesome day! 🚴‍♀️🚴‍♀️🚴‍♀️ ☕️☕️☕️☕️

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  20. Hi there! I don’t know if this comment has been made already (I’m sorry if it has) but on reading this post I was compelled to give MY reason for sometimes cycling in the middle of the lane.

    I live and cycle in the UK and unfortunately, as much as it’s written into our Highway Code, most drivers do not give me a metre or more of space while overtaking. I think some of this may be because it’s difficult to judge how far away a cyclist is when driving a vehicle that’s three times the width of most people. So when I cycle in the gutter, drivers see an opportunity to pass through a gap that’s scarcely there, and that’s a terrifying experience for a cyclist.

    Alternatively I can cycle in the middle of the road and if I do this then a driver has no choice but to move into the next lane to overtake, which virtually guarantees that I will be given enough space (I can always move in if a car is beginning to overtake using the next lane). In fact this is the recommended position to take on UK roads (https://www.cyclinguk.org/article/road-positioning-cycling-explained).

    Staying in the middle of the lane has other benefits. It improves a cyclist’s visibility on the road (unfortunately I have regularly been the recipient of “sorry love, I didn’t see you” when almost driven into by motor vehicles in broad daylight) and keeps us away from gutters, drains, collecting rainwater, broken glass (yes, it is sometimes a problem) and gives us space to manoeuvre around potholes.

    On a final note, I don’t know if the taxation is different in your country but as a regular recipient of the ‘you don’t even pay road tax’ argument, I’d like to clear up for any UK readers that in Great Britain, ‘road tax’ is actually an emissions levy. This explains why some ultra-low emissions motor vehicles are exempt from it. The money that pays for the upkeep of our roads comes out of our council tax, which is paid by anyone who lives in a house, really. Which includes every cyclist I know.

    I hope the above helps you to understand why cyclists sometimes adopt road positions that seem baffling to drivers. Until you’ve been close-passed as a cyclist by a large vehicle, I don’t think you can understand how terrifying it is. I do actually feel safer cycling in the middle of the road because drivers pass me with more space as a result.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Thank you for you input, Kpizz. It is highly valued and it is great to hear a perspective from another country.
      I would concur with you that the middle of the lane is the most sensible place to be, considered factors like water, broken glass and vehicles. I would be in that lane position, even without much road cycling experience.
      However, many cyclists here are riding to the right hand edge of the lane, as opposed to the middle. Their reasoning in doing so is what I failed to understand.
      This puts them closer to the vehicles, unless their theory is that they force a car to enter the other lane? I am not sure.
      Thanks again for your comment.

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  21. Here’s the thing… cyclists have just as much a right to be on the road and take up a lane as you do. You need to go round them. It’s more dangerous if we allow too much space as cars try to push past and push us off the road. Two abreast is legal and safer for cyclists.

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  22. I cycle a lot and would agree with this cyclists arguments even when there is a designated cycle path there is nearly always pedestrians walking down them. Also, very often cars pull out of junctions without looking or look and then pull out any way so if we are further from the edge we can move out the way easier.

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  23. My view is that having cyclists and motorists in the same vicinity is rather like trying to mix dogs and cats. It often goes horribly wrong. I found in cycling through France, that the french were far better motorists than the Brits. I now live in New York and am not convinced I want to cycle here at all – the potholes are enormous! What I do find is that if as a cyclist you push out a little into the road rather than being right up towards the gutter, you give yourself some leeway. It also forces the motorists to overtake you properly by moving into the other lane rather than trying to squeeze past you and get too close. Katie

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    1. Good point Katie. Thanks for the point about forcing the cars to move right over into the other lane to overtake the cyclists. However, that seems to be the problem. Cyclists may as well be in the car lane itself, for if there arenit, cars WILL try to squeeze past if the bikes are further over towards the kerb.

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